Transforming Finances: The Power of Coaching | DaRenda Hanson

PROFITABLE TALKS...

In this episode of The Profitable Creative, host Christian Brim speaks with DaRenda Hanson, a relationship manager and financial coach. They discuss the importance of financial coaching, the role of values in financial management, and the integration of personal and business finances. DaRenda shares insights on client success stories, the impact of accountability in coaching, and the significance of understanding one's money memories. The conversation also touches on common challenges faced by clients, the value of professional guidance, and the necessity of building trust and communication with clients.

PROFITABLE TAKEAWAYS...

• Financial coaching helps clients manage their money better.
• Understanding personal values is crucial for budgeting.
• Integrating personal and business finances is essential for entrepreneurs.
• Accountability is a key component of effective coaching.
• Client success stories highlight the impact of financial coaching.
• Money memories shape our financial behaviors as adults.
• Many clients struggle with understanding tax deductions.
• Professional guidance is necessary to navigate financial complexities.
• Trust and communication are vital in client relationships.
• Education is a significant part of financial coaching.

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Transcript

Christian Brim (00:29.538)
Welcome to another episode of The Profitable Creative, the only place on the interwebs where you will learn how to turn your passion into profit. Shout out to our one listener in Brandon, Vermont. Thank you, whoever you are. I am your host, Christian Brim. Joining me is Dorinda Hansen of the Core Group. Dorinda, welcome.

DaRenda Hanson (00:53.508)
Hello.

Christian Brim (00:55.214)
I know that you have been avoiding this recording and tried to sabotage it in many different ways, but I am glad to have you on and hear what you have to say.

DaRenda Hanson (01:11.428)
Thank you. I would like to say that I'm glad to be here.

Christian Brim (01:12.438)
Mm-hmm. And well, you know, as I told Jeremy, you were voluntold. But there's a point to my madness, so stick with me. okay. Tell us who Dorinda is.

DaRenda Hanson (01:18.478)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (01:27.332)
I am a relationship manager with Core Group. I've been an accountant for, dang, almost 20 years now. I know, that makes me feel old. I'm married, have two children, two dogs, live in the dream, a bulldog and a golden retriever.

Christian Brim (01:31.618)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (01:45.166)
What kind of dogs? What kind of dogs?

Christian Brim (01:51.0)
That's an interesting combination.

DaRenda Hanson (01:52.62)
very much opposites.

Christian Brim (01:54.638)
So what do you do in your fun time?

DaRenda Hanson (01:59.001)
I like to travel, but I also like to do home projects, like DIY projects, and that's how I, that's my stress relief, actually.

Christian Brim (02:01.123)
Yes?

Christian Brim (02:05.878)
Christian Brim (02:10.955)
Yeah, would be stress relief for me if it were destruction demo, but I don't think trying to create something, do it myself, I usually end up just more frustrated than...

DaRenda Hanson (02:25.514)
That's the part I love. Putting it back together, guess.

Christian Brim (02:27.51)
Really? Okay, well, alright, I'll leave that there. How long have you been with Core?

DaRenda Hanson (02:36.694)
I've been with CORE for five years.

Christian Brim (02:40.391)
And what do you do for your clients?

DaRenda Hanson (02:47.512)
I'm a relationship manager. Like I said, I always tell my clients that my job is to be their main contact here at core. If they have a payroll question, I can sometimes answer it, but I can always get it to the right person. They can answer it. If they have bookkeeping question, I can get them to the bookkeeper to answer that question. It's my job to educate them as much as they want to be educated on their financials. And some people want to lodge it.

A lot of education and some people don't. A lot of the clients just want us to do it because that's our specialty and not theirs and that's fine too. So I just always like to tell the clients that I'm there. I'm there for them at their capacity, however much they want to use me or how much they don't.

Christian Brim (03:34.154)
You have a side gig, a side hustle, if you will, doing personal financial planning. Tell me more about that.

DaRenda Hanson (03:45.058)
not planning, it's financial coaching. So yeah, so I take on clients and my clients are people who have enough money to cover their expenses. They just don't manage it well and they've identified that they don't manage it well and they want to do something about it. So I take that and I kind of get down to the nitty gritty with them and more times than not, it's opening up conversations between a married couple as to

Christian Brim (03:47.416)
Coaching, sorry, my bad.

Christian Brim (04:00.28)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (04:14.968)
you know, like who does what or where their money's going or get, cause married couples, lot of times don't talk about finances at all. It's a very big tension point for them. So I act as a third neutral party to open up that conversation and find out where their finances are. Usually it's more educating one than the other, cause usually there's one person that handles most of those finances. So it's, you know, we look at their budgets, we create a budget they can live with.

We help them set some goals and figure out how they can get from where they're at to reaching those goals. And then we can talk about other things too, like, do they have enough life insurance? What's their health insurance look like? Like, are they making the best financial decisions for their family and what they need?

Christian Brim (05:04.406)
Well, what I heard in there is that you're a marriage counselor. No, you don't have to do any counseling.

DaRenda Hanson (05:12.196)
Nope, I'm not a counselor.

Christian Brim (05:14.153)
so if they're at loggerheads and they're yelling at each other, you just disconnect.

DaRenda Hanson (05:20.74)
I will say you need to go find a counselor and then come back to me if you want my help.

Christian Brim (05:26.232)
Yes, I see. Well, that is interesting. And I can speak to my marriage. We don't talk about finances because we have very different values around money. And I didn't realize that when I got married that we were that different, although the warning signs were there. I just wasn't experienced enough to understand what they were. But

I think when you have people, whether that's business partners or a married couple or even an employee and employer that value money differently, that have different values around it, it can definitely cause friction. But I think because money is so ubiquitous, I mean, it touches pretty much everything in our lives.

lightning rod, if you will, that a lot of problems get sucked into. And a lot of times money isn't really the issue. It's just the issue that people present, the symptom that people present with that there are underlying problems that just get stuck there. Is that your experience?

DaRenda Hanson (06:49.784)
Yeah, you kind of hit the nail on the head with that because one of the first exercises that I have clients do is identify their values. And I tell them that, you know, if it's a married couple, his values don't have to match her values. Like there could be six different values that we're looking at. But then we find out how to write those values into the budget, assuming that they're. They're going to fit into the budget because those things are what someone will go out and break the budget for like if.

someone values going to get pampered once a month or massages or whatever, those are the things that even if they don't have that money written into their budget, they'll go out and blow the budget to do it. So we kind of hinge the budget off of those values. And if their values are traveling, then we find a way to set up a travel budget. If their values are spending time with their family, we find a way to fit some entertainment into that budget.

Christian Brim (07:29.87)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (07:44.61)
Yeah, because money is just a proxy for everything else, right? I mean, it's not anything, this may sound strange, but to me, money is not anything in and of itself. It's just a, it's a proxy for a lot of different things. Yes, it is a tool. And I mentioned that in my book, Profit First for Creatives, which you should all read. So you came to me a couple of months ago.

DaRenda Hanson (08:00.717)
It's a tool.

Christian Brim (08:12.426)
and said that you had some clients that were asking if you did a personal financial coaching in your capacity as a relationship manager. And you brought that to me and I said, hmm, let's dig into that a little deeper. And because of that conversation, we are incorporating that into our service offerings at the beginning of the year.

How do you see that working with a typical client that you work with, like someone that had asked about it?

DaRenda Hanson (08:51.278)
So right now, the clients that I work with on the core side, so on the core side, it's pretty much strictly their business finances that we look at, other than doing a personal tax return. And then on my coaching side, all that I'm looking at is their personal. So, but when you have a self-employed individual, those two have to marry somewhere. Like normally it's that a business owner sucking money from their business to cover their personal life. Or...

Christian Brim (09:11.032)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (09:19.544)
they're not paying themselves from the business and they're living on beans and rice in their personal life when they could be paying themselves a salary or taking money on the business, but they're just not quite sure how to do either one of those things or how they work back and forth. So what I see as that when we implement this, we will better be able to look at both sides of it and give them advice or teach them what they need to know in order to pull the correct

Christian Brim (09:33.368)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (09:48.408)
pay themselves out of the business reasonably to cover their personal expenses and know that their personal expenses are in an order that they're not taking too much out of the business and not leaving money in the business to grow the business or do whatever they need to do to buy assets and make that flourish. So I think it's more marrying the two so that they're comfortable and confident in the amount of money they're spending personally and what they're taking out of the business to cover those expenses.

Christian Brim (10:01.739)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (10:15.981)
Yes.

Yeah, I write about this in the book as well, that the money habits and mindsets that you have individually when you start the business, those translate into the business. So you can't put on a different hat when you walk into the business and be somebody differently, be somebody different, right? And so however you manage your money at home in your personal life is how you're going to manage it in the business.

DaRenda Hanson (10:36.633)
Right.

Christian Brim (10:47.446)
So I don't want to make it sound like someone's going to be very meticulous about their spending in their business and then just go hog wild and spend lavishly on the personal side, because that's probably not going to happen. But to the point you're making that there's, if

If you don't have your personal finances in line, it can really stress the business. I remember having a conversation with a guy, an entrepreneur a few months ago, and he was trying to decide if he could take money out of his business. And this guy had been in business over 10 years and it was a profitable business, but he was really hung up on like,

Should I take that money out of the business? Is it proper? And we kind of had this conversation around like, well, do you need it in the business? you and like what, are you feeling like you need to leave it in the business? And it really was kind of like this, this rainy day fund. Like if things went to hell on a handbasket, he could keep his employees, you know, on board. And I'm like,

Well, if, the bottom fell out and your business was losing money, would you keep those employees? And he was like, well, no. And I'm like, then why are you keeping money for that? Right. But there was this, he had really kind of twisted himself into a pretzel trying to decide whether he could write himself a check. so I don't, I don't think it really matters. what your, your, your value, your mindset around money is it has to be

It has to be consistent. You have to have a plan for both.

DaRenda Hanson (12:49.24)
Yes, exactly. And a lot of times when I'm talking to my business clients with core, and we talk about, you know, if they're taking an escort collection and you start payroll, well, how much do you need to cover? How much do you need monthly, personally to cover your expenses? And there are always the question is always like, well, I don't know, like, what can I take? And then inevitably, we come back around to the same the

Christian Brim (13:13.94)
All of it, all of it, take it all.

DaRenda Hanson (13:16.342)
the same thing about people asking, can I just take money out of the business? Is it really my money? And we have that same conversation you just had all the time. So I think doing this financial coaching will educate these business owners more on not only the personal side of it, which is what we're aiming for, but also the business side of it, because that's just it. We're the professionals and they don't know what's right or what. They just want to make sure they're doing it right.

most of the time. And they just know that they have money sitting there and they don't know what to do with it.

Christian Brim (13:46.797)
Yes.

Christian Brim (13:51.796)
Mm-hmm. Pay your accountant more. That's the answer. No, no, it's not the answer. Okay. I'm going to pivot here for a second. Tell me a story about a client that you've worked with where you felt like you, it really impacted you. what, what either because of what the client had done or what you brought to the table, you felt like

DaRenda Hanson (13:55.286)
Hahaha

Christian Brim (14:21.314)
that made an impact.

DaRenda Hanson (14:24.789)
Are you asking for the financial coaching side or core?

Christian Brim (14:30.59)
Either both.

DaRenda Hanson (14:31.748)
I think the same thing really applies for both. I had a client recently or they're still a client. It's a married couple and like my adult client, they have enough money to cover all their expenses and have extra safe for retirement. Their kids are in many activities, everything like that. And we don't even have bi-weekly meetings at this point. We just kind of check in. And like you and I have talked,

75, 80 % of coaching is accountability. And I was getting to the point in our meetings when I wasn't sure that I was still serving purpose for them, that I kind of felt like we were kind of through it. They're doing it on their own. They're doing really good. They've done everything I've asked of them. They've, they come to the table every time we meet, they're ready. Perfect client. And then we met a few weeks ago and he said, we have never talked about our finances the way we have.

Christian Brim (15:03.597)
right?

Christian Brim (15:10.018)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (15:28.962)
when we started working with you. He's like, you changed our lives with your coaching. And so to me, I felt like I wasn't able to bring anything new. Like I'd given them what I had, but it was still the accountability part of it to keep them on the same page, to have our check-ins. They have to update their budget when they talk to me. And it was just them saying.

Christian Brim (15:31.01)
Mm-hmm.

Hmm

Christian Brim (15:49.443)
Yeah.

DaRenda Hanson (15:54.456)
Like, no, you're still making a difference and you've made a difference. And I'm like, well, that's my whole purpose. That's why I do it. And the same thing on the, on the core side of it, you know, when I have clients and to me, I'm explaining something to them that's second nature to me, but they had no idea. And they're like, my gosh, it's so helpful. Like that's why I do it because I know this stuff. I do it in a day in and day out. But for our creatives, that's not their forte.

Christian Brim (16:05.826)
I'm explaining something to them that's second nature.

Christian Brim (16:21.522)
Yeah, no, it's not. I think back, you said accountability and I think that's definitely a big part of coaching. I think the other part that I think is important is drawing the answers and the conclusions out of the person. Because

You know, I guess when I first started the business, I never had a coach and my idea of a coach was my high school football coach who, you know, 80 % of the time was yelling at me because I was not doing something right. and maybe 20%, yeah, you know, at a boy, but it was very much a, teaching

telling me what I didn't know and then, holding me accountable to that standard. Right. And so I didn't think that I would be interested in coaching. I didn't think that, you know, that my experience was not something I wanted to replicate until I started thinking about like these professional athletes and they have coaches and I'm like, well,

What does that look like? Because how in the hell is someone going to teach Tiger Woods how to swing a golf club better? Like he, no, nobody's going to teach him something, skill wise that he, that he, doesn't know or hasn't heard of. Right. And what I, what I realized through my experience working with my coach over the last three years is that it's, it is definitely accountability, but it's also.

about drawing something out of you that was already there that you just didn't see. Have you had an experience like that?

DaRenda Hanson (18:24.418)
Yeah, so you mentioned earlier that like your innate behaviors with money are going to transfer over to your business from your personal. Another exercise that I actually do with clients is their earliest money memory, because a lot of times that earliest money memory is what has defined how they look at money. Or it may be, you know, when they were growing up all their parents did was argue about money.

Christian Brim (18:31.064)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (18:40.877)
Mmm.

Christian Brim (18:46.242)
Hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (18:51.94)
their parents didn't teach them anything about money, which is what I hear a lot. And all of those things decipher how they spend their money now, whether it's personal or business. I think so. Yes. So we go through that exercise with clients and it kind of is an epiphany as they even go through it as to why, you know, like they're like, yeah, like I see it now. That's that's who I.

Christian Brim (19:02.412)
Yes.

Christian Brim (19:13.78)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (19:21.134)
think about when I'm spending money or the situation I think about or whatever the case may be. And another thing is, you know, just having them go through their bank statements and see where they spent their money for the last three months. And that, yes, that alone, if they have a spending problem, that alone will open up some eyes.

Christian Brim (19:34.03)
people do that? okay. I've never done that, sorry.

Christian Brim (19:45.134)
To find a spending problem.

DaRenda Hanson (19:48.108)
if they're spending more than they make. Or if they're spending more than they want to in a category. Like sometimes people come to you and say, I eat out way too much. I spend too much on groceries. And then you look at their spending and that's not really where the problem is. but having them do that, if we need to dig into expenses more and like I just told them to do it. I didn't tell them they need to go look at their grocery bills or their eating out or their convenience store runs.

Christian Brim (19:49.727)
OK. All right, that's fine.

Christian Brim (20:00.92)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (20:15.341)
Right.

DaRenda Hanson (20:16.642)
But doing that in itself, they draw conclusions on their own as to, that's where it's going. They could have done that on their own. Like, didn't, they didn't need me to tell them to do that. They could have gone out and pulled those statements on their own.

Christian Brim (20:21.346)
Yeah. Yes. Correct.

Christian Brim (20:30.646)
Yes, that that exercise of your earliest money memory is interesting. I'm going to tell you what mine is and then you have to tell me what yours is. It's not a specific memory, but I do remember when I was young, my dad and my grandfather and pretty much all the males that I saw always had these

big wads of cash in their pockets, kind of like gangsters do. Yeah, it was weird. I kind of, my money habit that I learned, my money value that I learned was that money was always there. Like it just was, and if you didn't have it, you could go make more. And there's nothing

inherently wrong with that belief. And as a matter of fact, lot of entrepreneurs sign up with that thought process, but it led to some unhealthy habits because I, you know, I never really worried about not having money. And I think you, you should, I mean, I think you should plan for those seasons when something doesn't go as expected. And I never did that.

Which of course drove my wife nuts, but that's beside the point. So what was your earliest money memory?

DaRenda Hanson (22:08.942)
So my earliest money memory is it was after my parents were divorced. I was about nine years old and I had one of this baby doll for Christmas that was like an electronic baby doll. You like could feed it and all kinds of stuff. And it was expensive. And my dad, he has always been a blue collar worker, you know, never my neither one of my parents ever made a lot of money to speak of. And my dad bought me that baby doll for Christmas.

Christian Brim (22:37.742)
Hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (22:38.148)
and I probably played with it Christmas day and then I was done with it. Like that's all I did. And I remember at the age of nine that I felt guilty for that. Cause I knew that it was a lot for him to go get it. And then I played with it for a day and that was it. And I held onto that doll until I was probably 15 or 16 cause I wouldn't get rid of it because I felt so guilty.

Christian Brim (22:44.566)
Yeah.

Christian Brim (22:49.26)
Hmm.

Christian Brim (23:03.544)
So how did that show up for you as an adult in the way you think about money?

DaRenda Hanson (23:09.304)
So when I did this exercise, I realized that, well, I know that I'm a very frugal person when it comes to money. My husband's the complete opposite. But I am a frugal person and I tend to mirror my dad in that respect rather than my mom. My mom, not that she's not frugal, she's not as frugal. My dad is cheap. Like there's a difference between cheap and frugal. He's cheap.

Christian Brim (23:18.446)
Yes.

Christian Brim (23:36.532)
okay. So cheap is less than frugal. mean, you're going, okay. All right.

DaRenda Hanson (23:39.62)
Yeah, but I found that ironic because I didn't grow up around my I lived with my mom and my stepdad and my dad lived on the other side of the state like I did not live with him all the time and see his habits but I'm more mirrored his habits than I did my mom's.

Christian Brim (23:57.548)
Yeah, and that is interesting because I think it's interesting how we pick up things as children and carry them into adulthood and we don't even realize. And I'm talking very innocuous things like how you talk, sayings, mannerisms. And you don't really know where they come from or how you pick them up. I remember this summer we went to

DaRenda Hanson (24:14.788)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (24:26.358)
see my father-in-law and my wife and him were walking down the hill and they're about the same height and I'm like, my God, they're twins. And then a couple of weeks ago I caught her and she does this, yeah. And I'm like, holy shit, that's Sid. And she just, she was like.

Yeah, you're right. I mean, but at 55 she's just now realizing that she has these mannerisms that she picked up from her debt. Weird.

DaRenda Hanson (25:04.59)
Yeah, I'm a self-declared horrible gift giver. Like I never know what to get people as gifts. And I think part of it's because I overthink it because I want to buy them something that they're going to use. And then it's not going to in the closet for 15 years before they get rid of it. And I wonder if that goes back to that story. I don't know. My husband would tell you I'm a horrible gift giver probably.

Christian Brim (25:20.269)
Hmm.

Christian Brim (25:23.596)
Yeah. Yeah.

Christian Brim (25:29.602)
Well, on that subject, when my wife and I were dating, it was her birthday. No, it Christmas. And she said, I want a Ralph Lauren denim shirt. And I'm still in college, right? And so like, okay. So I go to Dallas, I think I went to Nordstrom's and I pick out this Ralph Lauren denim shirt. And

I give it to her and I'm really excited because I got her what she wanted, right? And she looked at it and she, could see it on her face. It was like, and she ended up taking it back and got a sweatshirt, a Ralph Lauren sweatshirt, which she still owns by the way, 31 years later. But since that point, I mean, I had to get beat up over, over time to realize that I can't pick out a gift for her.

DaRenda Hanson (26:14.904)
Ha ha ha ha.

Christian Brim (26:27.214)
And she's like, well, I'm just going to tell you what to get me. And I'm like, what, where's the gift giving in that that, that, that, mean, part of it is like making something or, mean, selecting something because I'm thinking of you. thought this would be good for you, something like that, but no, no, no, it's, it's send me a link. This is what I want for my birthday. And I'm like, this is the worst.

DaRenda Hanson (26:35.096)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (26:48.888)
Yeah, see I like that because I'm horrible at coming up with what to get someone without them sending me a link for it.

Christian Brim (26:55.214)
Well, just my statement is just go buy it your damn self. Why do I have to buy it for you? mean, how does that make it a gift? I I don't know. Anyway, what would you say the most common problem or problems that you encounter with your clients? What are some of the themes or threads that you see at core?

DaRenda Hanson (26:56.386)
Hahaha!

DaRenda Hanson (27:01.732)
True.

DaRenda Hanson (27:19.748)
at core, usually that they come to us and they know enough to not know enough. they they're like, should I take an S-corp election? Should I do this? so it's not a problem because that's what I like to do is educate them on what to do. But outside of that, they always have questions about, what's deductible, what's not? So I think it's just

Like I said, it's not a problem, but it seems to be like every client comes on about the same and you just go over the same stuff all the time to educate them on whatever they need to know.

Christian Brim (27:51.022)
Right?

Christian Brim (28:03.842)
Well, let me ask you a question about that, because that's interesting. Why can't they just Google that shit and get an answer? assuming, I'll go ahead and stipulate that what they see on Google is correct, why is it that they come to you anyway?

DaRenda Hanson (28:23.598)
I mean, you can Google anything, right? Like I always say, it's not that the information you need isn't out there. It's that you need it all in one place and someone to explain it to you the way that you can understand it. And I think that that's what it is with clients is they can Google this shit all day. But if they don't understand what it's telling them, then it's useless. And I think having a professional to come down to your level and explain it to you and assure you that yes, you're doing the correct thing or no, I wouldn't do that.

Christian Brim (28:25.731)
Right?

DaRenda Hanson (28:53.08)
then that's worth a lot that you're confident in the decision that someone's telling you. Now on the flip side, I guess this would be the problem that I didn't come up with well ago. A lot of people nowadays are getting information from Tik Tok or YouTube and it's not necessarily good information. And then they come to us and ask us our opinion and we will tell them our professional opinion. And then they disagree with it. That would be the biggest problem I have.

Christian Brim (29:22.36)
Do you think doctors have the same problem? where people are going to WebMD and coming in and diagnosing, hey doc, I actually have colon cancer and I need you to fix it. Yeah, I don't know how doctors.

DaRenda Hanson (29:25.159)
yeah.

DaRenda Hanson (29:34.533)
definitely. It's the same situation, just it's not your health, it's your business.

Christian Brim (29:41.708)
Yes, we had an interesting conversation a few weeks ago about how people pay you for professional advice and then don't follow it. And I said, it's kind of like going to the doctor and they tell you to do something and you don't do it. And I said, who does that? And you said, me all the time, right? So, you know,

DaRenda Hanson (30:06.637)
You

Christian Brim (30:10.894)
Talk about that for a minute because I think it's an interesting dynamic of like, why would you pay someone for a professional opinion to tell you what to do with your money and then ignore their advice? Why do you think that is?

DaRenda Hanson (30:25.924)
A, you don't trust them, or B, you've gotten information elsewhere that makes you think that there might be a better way to do it. And I would say that I'm always open to listen to what they have to say. Like I'll go research something to the nth degree. That's my downfall. But I'll go research something to the nth degree to see if it fits in their scenario. A lot of the times with tax laws, people tend to read what they want to read out of it and not

Christian Brim (30:29.922)
Okay.

Christian Brim (30:35.726)
Hmm.

Christian Brim (30:49.667)
Right?

Christian Brim (30:54.254)
Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (30:54.936)
the exceptions or something like that. So I would say that's in this case why you would want to hire a professional to either agree or disagree with your findings.

Christian Brim (31:07.414)
Yeah, I mean, I guess, and this would apply to physicians as well, if you don't like what the professional is telling you, you can always go find another professional and keep finding one until you get the answer that you want, potentially. But I think the thing that just really strikes me is that there's a lot of bad advice out there, right? There's a lot of people

doing just that, they're telling people what they want to hear. And that always resonates like, you agree with me. Okay, great. You know, and, and so I'm going to pick you and I'm going to decide what, what, you know, to do based upon what you say, because you agree with me. but you know, I'm not suggesting you need to go around and get a second professional opinion on everything, but if 80 % of the people are telling you that, you know, this is not what you should do. You,

DaRenda Hanson (31:40.974)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (32:07.116)
probably should listen to them rather than go and find somebody else.

DaRenda Hanson (32:10.884)
Right. I mean, have a good example this week from a medical professional who gave some advice to my family and we went against their choices and we came out better, but we knew that when we did that, that was our choice and not what they told us to do. But to go back to what you said, I tell clients all the time that finding an accountant is a lot like finding a doctor or a dentist. Like you hate finding a new one, but sometimes it's inevitable and you need to.

Christian Brim (32:21.718)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

DaRenda Hanson (32:40.248)
but you have to find someone who jives with you, gives you the answers when you ask for them, know, response to emails, answers the phone. Cause so many of them out there you only talk to once a year to produce a tax return. And that's just not what we do here at core. But I guess that's just to say that finding a new accountant can be as painful as finding a new doctor or dentist sometimes. And you don't ever know that they're giving you maybe.

Christian Brim (32:43.906)
Mm-hmm.

Christian Brim (32:53.825)
Right.

DaRenda Hanson (33:08.526)
all the advice you want to hear, but we're giving you the best advice that we see as professionally relevant to you.

Christian Brim (33:14.636)
Well, yeah, I mean, that's the reality. When you hire a professional for whatever reason, you really don't know the quality of their advice, right? So if I ask a doctor, you know, these are my symptoms, what do you think? And she says, you know, X, Y, Z, how do I know whether she's telling me the right answer or not? have to, your point, you have to trust her. And I think that trust is built upon the communication.

I use the example of a physician all the time because if you went to the physician and you didn't tell them your symptoms, they just had to go by the blood work or the x-rays, the imaging, and you didn't say anything, they're going to give you an incomplete and possibly bad diagnosis, right? There is a responsibility on you as the patient to communicate

you know your situation and I I find I think probably because accountants don't tend to be very chatty that those those conversations don't happen with accountants and You know if we don't know what's going on in your life your business your head We can't give you the best answer possible What do you what do you say to that?

DaRenda Hanson (34:40.728)
I tell my clients that all the time in our quarterly conversations that we have, know, like the conversations are not just to go over their financials or their tax return or talk about tax season coming up or whatever. It's to talk to them about what's going on in life, like what's going to affect your tax return or what's going to affect your business coming up this year. What are you looking forward to or what's going on in the business? And I am a self-defined, not a people person, but I enjoy those quarterly conversations with clients.

More than they do probably, but I like it because it's not just talking about numbers. It kind of gets me out of my number crunching and tax return element for a little bit and, you know, talks about what they're excited about, about the business and what they're looking forward to and where they're trying to get it. And in knowing those things allows me to better help them with my advice.

Christian Brim (35:33.838)
Dorinda, I very much appreciate your time today, even though it was non-consensual. I still appreciate it. I appreciate your experience here and your thoughts. Listeners, if you like what you hear, please rate the podcast, subscribe to the podcast, share the podcast. If you don't like what you hear, you don't like Dorinda, and you don't like Christian, shoot us a message and tell us what you'd like to hear next time.

DaRenda Hanson (35:40.332)
Hahaha

Christian Brim (36:03.854)
Until then, ta ta for now.

DaRenda Hanson (36:06.756)
Thanks, Christian.